Personal Life Media

Transcript

Susan Bratton: Welcome to Dishy Mix. I’m your host Susan Bratton, and on today’s show we have part two of a two part series with John James Santangelo. John’s an amazing speaker – you’ll hear that the minute you hear him talk. He’s an author, the author of a new book called Speak Up With Power. He leads amazing seminars and trainings and he’s a success and a performance coach. And the minute you connect with him you’re going to know why. So lets get him on the show to talk more about how to speak up with power and influence. Welcome John.

John Santangelo: Welcome again.

Susan Bratton: Can you welcome me to my own show?

John Santangelo: I can. Welcome Susan. Thanks for coming by.

Susan Bratton: You could do anything you want; you’re John James Santangelo, for gods sakes. So in our first part we talked a lot about what is an LP, how do we manage and control our emotions to be more able to connect with other people, how do we get into another persons world to create better repertoire with them, how do we set some goals for ourselves. We did a visualization practice that was about invoking our confidence.

What else did we do? Did I forget anything?

John Santangelo: I think you hit it on the head.

Susan Bratton: We did a lot. We covered a lot of stuff. Speak Up With Power, if you’re tuning in by accident to part two no problem. They do stand alone, and this particular episode John and I are going to spend a lot of time really going through the language part of his training about speaking up. We’re going to talk about the five step selling process. We’re going to talk about something called Representation Systems so you can get a better idea about how to connect with other people. We’re going to learn about hypnotic language patterns that you can use both to connect and create better repertoire with not only the people you talk to but with your customers and prospects when you’re writing copy for them. We’re going to talk about these hypnotic language patterns, and we’re going to talk more about understanding what you want so you can ask for it and enlist the help of others, whether that’s your customers, your prospects, your family, your office mates. So lets get started John. Thanks so much for coming back and spending so much time with us to do a two part series.

John Santangelo: Oh this is fun and it’s exciting. Thank you.

Susan Bratton: You love talking about this stuff, don’t you?

John Santangelo: Oh I love it.

Susan Bratton: It’s pretty much all you do.

John Santangelo: Especially the language, this is the best part.

Susan Bratton: Yeah. So do you want to start out with the hypnotic language patterns and the power words and all those pieces of it or do you want to start out with the five step selling process, which is a better way for you to kind of get this, teach us everything?

John Santangelo: Probably start out with the language first because it really is the basis of how to do the five step selling process. So we ended the last one about working with somebody’s map or repertoire and representational systems, and that means as we said in the first one – if you haven’t listened to it go back and listen to it now – that we’re working with somebody’s representational systems, inside visual, auditory or kinesthetic; whether they’re visual type learner, an auditory type learner or a kinesthetic or feeling type learner. When I communicate with people, the words I choose are going to match somebody’s representational system, and I’m going to use more visual words like “I see”, “That looks good”, “It appears to me”, or words as auditory person maybe “I hear you”, “That sounds good”, “That resonates with me”, and a kinesthetic words, “I feel it”, “I get a grasp on that”, “I get a handle on that.” The more that I can match somebody’s internal world and build repertoire with them, I’m able to then communicate my ideas. The premise of really the L in NLP is lingustic or language. And one of the things that I found in working with people is that we come – especially in American society – we come from negations, and a negation is we use a lot of words like “don’t”, “shouldn’t”, “can’t”, “won’t”, and the unconscious mind, the unconscious mind that runs 90 percent of us does not understand negations; it only understands what’s being said. So for instance, if I said to you “Don’t, do not, whatever you do don’t think of a blue tree”, where does your brain have to go? You’ve got to think of a blue tree. So you can’t think about what you don’t want to think about without thinking about it. Think about it. So the first things is be congnisant and aware of how we communicate our ideas. One of the things that we say in LP is this: say it the way you want it. Say it the way you want it to have happen. Give you another example; a personal relationship. People say “I don’t want you to treat me like that. Don’t treat me like that.” Now the unconscious mind is registering “Treat me like that” and it asks how or what, “Treat you like that?” So you’re not giving any direction when you’re speaking. The same in copywriting; you can use a negation in copywriting, and I’ll talk about that in a moment, but most people say, you know, “Don’t buy this product”, something that… and they get into this whole world of it’s really their map, they’re communicating is their map. And so what we want to talk about is how can we influence other people by really telling them what to do, in a way that it doesn’t have any resistance in it. We want to bypass the conscious mind and speak to the unconscious mind. So words like “don’t”, “shouldn’t”, you can eliminate those and tell them exactly what to do, especially online, and you’ve probably heard this if you’ve done copywriting or website design and writing for websites is give them information and tell them what to do, tell them exactly what to do. The listener or the follower or the reader of the information needs to know that there’s a process of what to do next, and a lot of people don’t understand that. So with hypnotic language we can say things like, again, I can use, I’m going to use negation, so things like “don’t”, “I don’t think that you should buy this product right now.” So the brain is hearing “Buy the product right now.” And what that does is it bypasses the resistance of the conscious mind rather than me saying, “Look, you need to buy this product right now.”

Susan Bratton: Well I notice that the copy on your sales page at speakupwithpower.com says “Don’t you want people to listen to your ideas and opinions?

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: Now they’ll pay attention when you do talk.” Or you have another one: “Haven’t you always been interested in being able to read and interpret body language accurately?

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: Know what others are really thinking by how they gesture and move their body, hands and even their eyes.” You have another one too: “Wouldn’t you like to have unshakable confidence when you need it? Imagine feeling those feelings of certainty and conviction all the time. Be able to walk into any situation and feel sure of yourself no matter how long you felt less confident than you like.” Okay, that’s a ton of NLP in there.

John Santangelo: Yeah, very hypnotic language.

Susan Bratton: Why are you writing it that way? What’s it doing to us?

John Santangelo: Well one of my beliefs is this: when we communicate with people we’re only doing one of two things; we’re compelling people or we’re repelling people. So the language, when you read it, compels people. I mean people think about how they construct their, the syntacs of how they construct their language and their world when they communicate, don’t realize most of the time they’re repelling with their language. What is it in your sentence or in your copywriting that allows the client or the reader to really buy in to what it is that you’re saying, that’s a feeling; we’re generating feelings all the time and you’re copywriting to generate a feeling of them to say “I want more.” Now read it back to somebody else. A lot of what, you know, Susan and I we’re going back and forth in doing a lot of the work and designing some of the stuff that I’ve written, and she’s looked at it and said, “I don’t understand what that means John”, and I say, “Well tell me, let me restate it and tell me how it feels.” And as soon as people buy into the feeling they’re going to buy into the sentence or they’ll buy into the product, however that is. You got to compel them to… Again, we make decisions through our feelings. So when you say it the way you want it and you say it in a hypnotic language, that it really compels the person to understand, “Wow, this makes sense to me. That really looks good and that feels good to me. I need this”, or “I want to learn more.” That’s how really most copywriting is written.

Susan Bratton: One of the ads that I just saw for a casino in San Diego, the copy on their ad was “What will your Berona moment be?”

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: That’s the whole billboard; “What will your Berona moment be?”

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: And in that, in asking it in that way it seemed really clever to me, like they were allowing me to fill in the blanks, the specifics. They were opening my mind so that I would put myself into the future and create my own Berona moment in my mind…

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: They didn’t have to sell me; they were getting me to sell myself.

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: What is that thing called that they’re doing to me and how can I do more of that? I think it’s hellishly clever.

John Santangelo: Tap into, it’s really what we call a mind read because you really don’t know what they’re going to think…

Susan Bratton: Right. You don’t care what they’re going to think ‘cause they’re all going to customize their own thought…

John Santangelo: Exactly.

Susan Bratton: for themselves; I love that.

John Santangelo: So first is you have to know the context. If nobody knew what Berona they’d go “What the heck is that?”

Susan Bratton: Well it’s on a billboard and it shows casinos, so…

John Santangelo: Right….

Susan Bratton: There’s a picture.

John Santangelo: So we know it’s a casino, so we know basically what our behaviors are going to be in that casino…

Susan Bratton: Right.

John Santangelo: Which is what?

Susan Bratton: Bad, very bad. We’re going to have very bad behavior in that casino, especially if you and I go together.

John Santangelo: I’m going to take my clothes off and run around.

Susan Bratton: I’m going with you.

John Santangelo: We want to win money.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: We want to have a good time…

Susan Bratton: We want to drink.

John Santangelo: We want to have fun; that’s the whole presupposition or assumed belief as we…

Susan Bratton: Right.

John Santangelo: say in LP. So the question really allows the person to stretch themselves out in the future, see themselves in the event, maybe talk to themselves and get a feeling of “Wow, I’d like to win money. I want to go be entertained. I want to have a great time. I want to relax”, whatever that is. So they get to, like you said, fill in the picture that this question left off and the imagination you know is more stronger than reality, as Einstein said, expectation of reality. So allowing the client to fill in the blanks, that’s real power because again, you’re not telling them so much what to do, you’re giving them instructions and allowing them to follow through, because when I’m working with people I never want to tell people what to do, I always want to give them choice. If you give people choice they feel empowered. And empowerment and confidence, those are strong emotions that people long for that we don’t have in society nowadays.

Susan Bratton: You have a thing in Speak Up With Power that is, there’s one page that has like 108 power words…

John Santangelo: Uh huh.

Susan Bratton: Tell us about that too, ‘cause that kind of, I’ve been using more of those words; I have it posted right up in front of my computer now, and I’m using those verbs as I type. Like, I wrote an email and I looked at it and thought, “How could I incorporate more power words in it?” I rewrote it and I couldn’t believe how much better it was.

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: Tell us about that. What’s that thing?

John Santangelo: Well if you go back to using predicate words and how people interpret their world, we have a certain amount of I guess influence in the words that we do use, because even though that, the words are only 7 percent of our communication, they can be majorly effective when we use them appropriately and contextually. So these words that, it was a study done that’s I think it was 60 percent of the people found that these words cause them to take action. So we put this in and it really give people ideas ‘cause, again, we want to fill in our own blanks because what I do in my life doesn’t necessarily work in somebody else’s, so what I do is try to lead them and give people choice. So using these words, it really helps build in their vocabulary, because I think what I’ve seen in coaching a lot of people is we get stuck. We get stuck in doing our way all the time and come to a conclusion like that, “Wow, I need to learn more. I’ve got to do something different.” You know, one of the things that we talk about as being a counselor or a coach is people come to us for two reasons: one, they’re doing, they’re doing behaviors, they don’t want to do and they’re feeling feelings they don’t want to feel. We tend to get stuck in our world. And so this just gives us an opportunity to have more choice and more resources – as that was a word you used before; I love that word, ‘resources’ – and it adds more resources and it adds more flexibility to our behavior. And when you can do that people can find more ways of doing things.

Susan Bratton: One of the things that I learned from Mark Michael Lewis – ‘cause he taught me a lot of NLP before I met you – one of my favorite pre NLP suppositions is – and I’m going to get it wrong so you can fix it for me – but what he said was the person with the most behavioral flexibility wins…

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: What’s the actual phrase?

John Santangelo: The system or person with them most flexibility will control the system.

Susan Bratton: Yeah. That’s unbelievable.

John Santangelo: All that means, it’s just basically what I just said; we get stuck, and the more flexible you are in your approach to doing a new behavior or a behavior that you’ve had in the past, the more opportunity or possibilities, Deepak Chopra calls it, the possibility lies outside what we’ve done in the past, but that’s where the fear lies, in the possibility. It’s the unknown, and the unknown is scary. And so very few people will step out to the edge or on the edge of it going, “Wow, I’ve got to jump. I’ve got to take that leap. I’ve got to do a new behavior. I’ve got to try something different.” I’ve got to say something, lets say, to my boss or communicate an idea to a loved one; that’s scary because it’s rejection. So behavioral flexibility gives us the ability to say, “You know what, it’s okay.” As Edison said inventing the incandescent light bulb, “I haven’t failed five thousand times; I’ve found five thousand ways it’s not going to work.”

Susan Bratton: Right. There is no failure, only feedback.

John Santangelo: Imagine if he stopped at five thousand attempts; we’d never have electric light or electricity.

Susan Bratton: Do you think that’s true? Do you think he tried five thousand times? That’s a lot of times.

John Santangelo: You know, it’s said over and over again it was over ten thousand.

Susan Bratton: Oh really?

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: You think so?

John Santangelo: Yeah…

Susan Bratton: I know he has a lot of patents…

John Santangelo: I’ve done a lot of research on it and…

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: it’s amazing. I mean they say that Colonel Sanders…

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: at 65, his story’s amazing. At 65 he got his first social security check, $135 dollars, and said, “This isn’t enough.” He had a chicken recipe and he went out one thousand and one times before a restaurant would even take his recipes and said, “Look, we’ll do it on consignment; you sell the chicken, I get half.” One thousand and one, at 65 years old. That’s behavior flexibility.

Susan Bratton: Yeah. Definitely.

John Santangelo: That’s huge. That’s the true gift of life - that really is - to get what we want.

Susan Bratton: If we can invoke that calm and confidence with anchors and have behavioral flexibility and then know that we’re reliant on other people to help us accomplish our goals…

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: and use your goal setting worksheet to figure out exactly what we want…

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: that’s a really good system. It’s like, “Okay, now I know what I want. I’m going to get… Now I know how to get into your world and be empathetic….

John Santangelo: And help you…

Susan Bratton: to you…

John Santangelo: get what you want.

Susan Bratton: And help you get what you want…

John Santangelo: through win-win…

Susan Bratton: Right, exactly.

John Santangelo: manage my states…

Susan Bratton: Manage my states, yeah.

John Santangelo: build repertoire…

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: understand why you’re doing this so I can help you and you can help me…

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: And then communicate the idea through your map; overcome any obstacles or objections, which is flexibility, and then ask, ask for agreement. So many people are afraid to ask.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: It’s like rejection plays a huge part, guilt, all these negative emotions play a huge part in our world.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: That’s not to say that I’m perfect either; I face these challenges everyday. But I have the tools now to step out of my own way.

Susan Bratton: Yeah. I actually think you’re damn close to perfect John. In my work with you over the last year…

John Santangelo: Wow!

Susan Bratton: in creating Speak Up With Power, I actually find you really easy to work with. I have a great repertoire with you. It’s fun to interact with you. When we co-create things I learn from you and I feel like you probably learn from me too…

John Santangelo: Absolutely. I mean both you and Tim are just so powerful people because I think and I truly believe this about our relationship, is that we’re so flexible in what we do, ‘cause we do bounce a lot of ideas, and I get to learn from Tim and he gets to learn from me when I have ideas that he doesn’t know, which is very rare.

Susan Bratton: Yeah, it’s hard to stump Tim, I know. Little sucker.

John Santangelo: And from you, I love learning from you because….

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: we’re in different industries and so it’s cross contextualizing…

Susan Bratton: True.

John Santangelo: information.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: And it really is about communicating. That’s what I love about what I do; everything is about communicating your ideas and expressing your emotions so you can get more of what you want and love in life.

Susan Bratton: And have more fun doing it. I think…

John Santangelo: Yes, absolutely.

Susan Bratton: the point that I was making, it was great to be able to tell you how much I love you, but I tell you that all the time. It was really just so that, there’s a tangible benefit to working with someone whose been trained in NLP, who has that level of behavioral flexibility and communication mastery.

John Santangelo: Absolutely.

Susan Bratton: It’s pure joy. And so I think what I’m saying here is I’ve been studying NLP, I’ve been working on myself around my level of communication and I consider myself to be one of those people that’s more in the Olympic mastery than in the, you know, working from a point of fear because I love communicating, I am a communicator, I’m a talker…

John Santangelo: Mm hmm.

Susan Bratton: and that’s what drew me to NLP. So for a lot of people your product can help them if they don’t feel like they have all the things that they want, but it can equally be for people who are in sales or who are out in the public eye; it works for everybody. This system to me – now I sound like a damn infomercial – but…

John Santangelo: No, you’re right.

Susan Bratton: But it does sound like, but it does work because all it, it hits everything that you need to actually figure out what you want, ask for what you want, get what you want. I love that.

John Santangelo: Selena Williams, Tony Robbins, the president…

Susan Bratton: Right, exactly.

John Santangelo: they all have great coaches.

Susan Bratton: Yes.

John Santangelo: The best of the best is consistently learning how to become better at what they do.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: I have a coach. You know, I study from my students because I don’t know everything.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: So if you feel stuck, if you feel like you’re not getting what you want, step out of your comfort zone. That’s the first thing, you’ve got to make the commitment we talk about; you’ve got to make the commitment.

Susan Bratton: Get some new tools, learn some new techniques.

John Santangelo: Exactly.

Susan Bratton: Hey, we have to go to a break ‘cause I want to thank my sponsors; I’m so appreciative of them. I want to make sure that they get time to get their stories in. And when we come back I want to go through the five step selling process. It’s very similar to how you’d also approach negotiation and it’s a really good example of how all of these things we’ve been talking about over this last episode and a half come together. So lets do that, shall we?

John Santangelo: Sure, absolutely.

Susan Bratton: Alright. I just want to remind you that you can get a copy of Speak Up With Power as a Dishy Mix listener. If you go to speakupwithpower.com you can save a hundred bucks. John and I want you to take us to lunch, but if you want to keep the hundred dollars in your pocket you could do that, it’s your choice, but no matter what we want you to save a hundred dollars. Just use my promo code ‘dishy’ when you go to speakupwithpower.com and you will get to keep a hundred dollars. The second thing is that we’re giving away one free copy to a Dishy Mix fan. If you want to get the free copy of Speak Up With Power - all 20 audio files, the whole workbook, all the goal setting worksheets, everything – just go to dishymixfan.com and post your desire. John and I will pick our favorite, make it good and we’d love to give you a copy. If you don’t want to do any of that and all you want is the free stuff, free stuff, free stuff, you can go to Speak Up With Power and get The Top Ten Best Kept Secrets To Persuade and Influence Anyone Anytime, and if you send John an email at [email protected] he will also send you the goal setting worksheet that’s inside the whole system, and he’ll just send you that for free. So there’s lots of stuff you can have here. We want you to have as much of it as we can possibly give you. Take it all. And we’ll come back from a break, and we’ll get into the five step selling process integrating all these great techniques we’ve learned. So stay tuned and we’ll be right back.

Susan Bratton: We’re back, and John I can’t wait for you to get into it. So let it rip. Tell us how we should be selling now.

John Santangelo: The five step selling process, again, was modeled from some experts that were doing this naturally. And even they didn’t know how they were doing it because it’s a natural thing for them. It’s like driving our car now; at one time you’re all frustrated, remember having learned how to drive a stick shift? You’ve got to focus on this, the pedal, the gas, the rearview mirror and the left (unintelligible) and the person sitting in the car and all this; you’re overloaded. Now it’s automatic. It’s the same thing with great salespeople. It’s automatic for them. They know how to do it effortlessly. And so we’ve modeled this. And the five step process is simply this: establish repertoire, ask questions, find a need and value, link the need and value to your product or service, and second, ask for the sale. It’s really simple. So to get into it is first establishing repertoire, which we talked about in the first lesson of this first interview we did. And the second part about asking questions, they kind of go in alignment with each other. You’ve got to be able to have repertoire with somebody to ask the questions. You’ve got to be able to build that bridge. And again, establishing repertoire is based on mirroring, matching physiology, which is 55 percent of our communication – 38 percent is tonality and 7 percent is the content chunks or keywords. You’ve got to be able to match that to build the bridge and then ask the right questions. I actually wrote a book on this, is asking the right question is half the answer, that’s what Aristotle said. Asking the right questions really allows them to give you and gather information. And all, here’s what we were talking about yesterday in my NLP training: it honor and respects the person you’re talking to when you’re truly interested in who they are and what they’re all about. Most sales training talk about filling the product or need that you need, filling your quota at the end of the month, making sure you get the sale… You know what, the client doesn’t care. They don’t care about you, they care about who? Themselves. When you make yourself truly interested and honor and respect their world, they’re going to give you what you need, which is the information at how they like to buy, which is, I love that quote “Nobody wants to be sold, but people love to buy things.” And when you tap into their buying strategy, which we talk about in another program, you tap into their buying strategy and how they buy, you can literally give them enough information that they’ll decide what it is they want from you.

Susan Bratton: Wait, before we go to finding the need and the value… On the asking questions, what kind of questions are we supposed to be asking? How do we figure that out?

John Santangelo: Well, here’s the thing, I actually worked with a salesperson and he came back to me the next day and said, “My god John, that was amazing. I left my books at home. I left my sales book, I walked in with a blank page and I just became interested in who they were.”

Susan Bratton: Natural curiosity.

John Santangelo: Yes. “Hey, how are you? What do you do for a living? What’s your family like?” I mean, if you’re really paying attention you’ll know when to ask the right question and when to ask the wrong question.

Susan Bratton: Yeah.

John Santangelo: It’s just natural conversation, but people get so wrapped up into, “I’m sitting here. I have an appointment. I’ve got to make the sale. I’ve got to sell something.”

Susan Bratton: Yeah, we put so much pressure on ourselves that it’s like our brain flies out of our head. And we also don’t start as a beginner; we think we have to know everything. Now you do need to do some homework, right?

John Santangelo: Sure.

Susan Bratton: But that should create some really good questions for you…

John Santangelo: Absolutely.

Susan Bratton: Okay, so there was no special magical NLP oriented…

John Santangelo: No.

Susan Bratton: sentence construct question…

John Santangelo: No.

Susan Bratton: we need to know; we have to just ask smart questions, use our brain…

John Santangelo: If you become interested in them, they will become interested in you; it’s that simple.

Susan Bratton: Of course; that’s the secret of being a popular journalist.

John Santangelo: You wouldn’t meet somebody on the street, try and sell them something right away and try to build a friendship; it just doesn’t work that way. Build a friendship, build a relationship, they’ll buy from you. That’s the way, there is no selling. There really isn’t anyway. So, people come in thinking, “Well I want to learn how to sell better.” I say, “Well then you’re not in this class for the right reasons”, because we don’t sell anything, we get people to buy from us. We want raving fans.

Susan Bratton: I love raving fans.

John Santangelo: Love that.

Susan Bratton: Me too. Okay, so then find…

John Santangelo: find a needed value…

Susan Bratton: Okay.

John Santangelo: Uncover their needs. What is it they… In the conversation, ask appropriate questions. Lets take for example a real estate agent; “Well when was the last time that you bought a house?”, and here’s a great question, “How did you decide? What allowed you to decide that that was the house for you?” ‘Cause I can tell you this, they’re going to say one of three things: “It looked good”, “It sounded good”, “It felt good.” And here’s an example of how salespeople mismatch a client: the client will come in and go “Wow, this is really nice.” And the real estate agent may say something like this, “Doesn’t it just feel good when you walk in the house? You get this kind of environment that just resonates with you.” And the woman will say, “No, actually I hate the wallpaper, the way it looks.” She’s talking from a visual system and he’s talking from a kinesthetic system.

Susan Bratton: Got it.

John Santangelo: The same thing can be with, the gentleman might say – or not the gentleman – the real estate agent may say, “Doesn’t this house just look phenomenal, when you walk in, the marble tile floor, the pool in the background?” And she says, “No. I hate the construction site; the sound of that is driving me crazy. Is this going on all the time?” That’s an auditory system. So we’ve got to be really cognisant of how people buy from, you know, from others and that’s a really great strategy to learn; ask what they’ve bought before.

Susan Bratton: Well and one of the good things about what you have in the workbook is that you take a quiz, you give us a quiz in the workbook and we can figure out what we are…

John Santangelo: What you are, right.

Susan Bratton: So that gives you some insight into not only how you like to be spoken to – maybe you can share that with your spouse and your children and your family and your co-workers, you know, “Here’s a good way to get into my space, right, read my map.” But also it does give you a better sense of how you can begin to read others.

John Santangelo: Absolutely because once you understand where you’re coming from you can notice, you begin to notice what we call one of the other presuppositions of NLP is communication is not our intention, it’s never your intention, it’s the response that you get in return. I mean I can say something like this to you Susan: “Susan I love you.” My intent is to communicate I love you, but what response did I get in return?

Susan Bratton: You sound, I laughed.

John Santangelo: Right, you’re scared, it’s like…

Susan Bratton: I thought maybe you were mad at me.

John Santangelo: We’re doing this over the phone, so…

Susan Bratton: Right.

John Santangelo: If we were doing it in person my body language would represent that too. So all of me is talking to you in a way that’s most, is going to push you away. So it’s never my intent, it’s always the communication I get back. So when, after you take this test and you understand that you may be a visual person and you’re communicating, lets say, to a kinesthetic person, you’re talking words of “Doesn’t this look good? I mean, when you look out on the horizon doesn’t that appear just to set all this clear for you?” And the client may be going, “No, it just doesn’t feel right to me. I just don’t get a handle on this.” You’ve completely mismatched their internal map, their world inside. So when you understand where you are…

Susan Bratton: This stuff is pretty simple.

John Santangelo: it’s easier to understand what’s going on outside the world, if you’re truly paying attention, I mean you truly care about the client.

Susan Bratton: So then, alright, the first thing I’ve done is I’ve taken my time – big deep breath, don’t go in selling, go in creating and establishing repertoire and getting into their world…

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: Then show some interest and ask some intelligent questions. Then once you’ve done that, uncover the need and how they’re thinking about how they’re making their buying decisions – if they’re visual, auditory or kinesthetic…

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: Then you have something that you call ‘agreement frames.’ Tell us about that.

John Santangelo: That is a great question because this can really set the next step or it can literally create a blocked wall between you and the client. One of the things that I’ll tell my students is never say the word “I understand”, because you can’t. You will never be able to understand somebody else’s world, ever, and that can immediately shut somebody down unconsciously. So the agreement frames in NLP are “I agree”, “I respect”, and “I appreciate.” And from there, what we call causal linkages, which are words that move somebody from one position to the next. Here’s another word we try to help people stay away from, which is the word ‘but’, ‘cause that negates everything I just said…

Susan Bratton: Yeah, say ‘and’.

John Santangelo: “Susan, I really love you but…”

Susan Bratton: John, I really love you and I want you to tell me about linking the need to the product.

John Santangelo: Exactly. ‘And’ is a great word. The causal linkage is just a bridge to something else, so “I really agree with what you’re saying and how will this work for you?” Or what we call future pacing in NLP, “I really respect that your idea is on this product or service and I think that when you look out into the future and you see how this is going to work for you, I think you’re really going to know that this is the best decision that you could make right now.” Now I put them out in the future; a really strong word is ‘imagine’, that’s a great word…

Susan Bratton: I was just about to read some copy from your landing page. You wrote – I’ve got to get this the, close enough to the mic – “Imagine what it will feel like when others all of a sudden think how lucky you’ve become. You’ll get what you want, have the ability to talk to anyone and become more successful in your career.” That’s one of the things on your landing page, ‘imagine’. You’re putting, it’s kind of like the Barona moment.

John Santangelo: I put in all of the modalities; the visual, the kinesthetic and the auditory and AD, for the AD, the auditory digital people, logical, ‘imagine’, ‘feel’ is a kinesthetic word, ‘think’ is a very AD word, ‘tell you what you’re going to get’, ‘talk’; I include all those modalities in the words when I’m communicating to people because if a visual person reads that, they’re going to go, “Feel? I don’t get how I feel. But I can imagine what that feels like.” See, I’m a very visual person, ‘cause we talk really fast. One of the things that I said to one of my students the other day and it’s funny, I recognize, I said, “I see what you’re saying.” Now how do you see what somebody is saying? You can’t, but you can understand, maybe, maybe not, but when I agree, I respect, I appreciate, we start to match their internal world, that’s power.

Susan Bratton: Nice. I like it. It’s so copasetic too.

John Santangelo: Yeah. That’s good, copasetic. I like that word.

Susan Bratton: Copasetic. So then there’s another thing that you have in the fourth step when you’re doing the link, linking the need to the product, your conditional (unintelligible), “What if”, “Imagine.” So when you say “fire off anchors of trust”…

John Santangelo: Yeah.

Susan Bratton: what do you do there?

John Santangelo: That’s a very complex and more of a master, a master communicator. When you’re in repertoire, like we talked about in the first interview about setting anchors, you’re able to recreate those feelings of trust again, when somebody is in, lets say, a buying state or in a selling state. So what I’ll do is when I’m in repertoire with somebody and I’m usually getting a congruent “yes” from them, especially if they nod their head and say the word ‘yes’, I’m going to do something unique. I may tap my finger three times on the table or click my pen a couple of times. I may nod with them and say, “Yes.” I can do something different so that when it comes time to ask for the sale, and when I’m linking my product to their need, I will fire off that anchor, which is going to cause them to feel those feelings of trust and repertoire again. That’s very powerful stuff.

Susan Bratton: So do I set those anchors in the repertoire state and then bring them back out in…

John Santangelo: Yes.

Susan Bratton: the time when I’m linking the need.

John Santangelo: Yes. Anytime, anytime you feel a connection, anytime you’re getting a congruent ‘yes’ with them – it can be even in an argument where they’re saying “yes”, ‘cause as long it’s a congruent ‘yes’ – ‘cause an argument just is about feelings, that’s all that is, and if they’re feeling the word ‘yes’, “Yes, I totally understand you”, and that’s a congruent ‘yes’. So I can use that also. Anything that allows the client to feel comfortable, to build a bridge, to feel repertoire, to understand what’s going on, I’m going to attach it to something. It could be a word I, it could be something I do, something that, it could be something visual, whatever that is, those are powerful tools. And, again, this is like the master level of communication when you can start anchoring people into certain states of mind.

Susan Bratton: It’s fascinating. I would love to learn how to do that; I’ve got to learn more about that. When we’ve linked the need to our product, when I’ve linked my customers need to my product, how do I ask for the sale?

John Santangelo: Simply ask. People are going to go, “Well what does that mean?” Well I would say something like this, “How can we”… and you can fill in the blanks, “If we were to sign the contract now and you were to buy the product is that possible?” I just simply ask. I don’t fluff it up, I don’t make it complex for them. You just need to ask. If you ask in the right way, if you ask with integrity, if you ask with the purpose of a win-win, you’re going to get a real honest answer. And then from there you can decide, “Well maybe I need to use my behavioral flexibility again. Maybe I need to ask in a different way.” I just think all of it’s about honesty and integrity, and when you come from a place, people will feel that, they’ll know it. If you’re really working for their best interests, they’re going to get a good understanding, “You know what, this person really cares about me. They really honor and respect their product or their service, and I think this is going to work.” So many people are afraid to ask the right questions, and we know what the right question is: “Is this something that you really see yourself using? Is this something that you feel is going to work for you? Can I tell you how this is going to work, and also when you talk to yourself, do you know that this is the right decision you’ve made buying this product?” And also what we call presuppositions, assuming the sale. This is not brain surgery, this is really easy stuff, but we get so far away from it because our fears. Rather than just being honest up front and letting our stuff on the table after we’ve built that repertoire and trust, things are actually pretty simple.

Susan Bratton: Thank you for going through that process. A lot of that was familiar to me, but there were so many little nuances of language, and that was the thing that I noticed the most when I read through the whole workbook.

John Santangelo: Right.

Susan Bratton: I appreciated that you created goal setting for me, I appreciated understanding more about, that the creation of repertoire can be so significantly increased at the physical level.

John Santangelo: Yes.

Susan Bratton: It isn’t about what I’m saying to you…

John Santangelo: No.

Susan Bratton: And I didn’t understand that until I read Speak Up With Power. So I’m really looking forward to getting out of my office and getting in front of people and working on repertoire at an even higher level.

John Santangelo: Let me give you a simple exercise anyone that’s listening can do. Anytime you meet somebody – doesn’t matter, if it’s the bank, the bank teller, the guy at the gas station – practice on somebody that’s really easy in they’re quick interactions. Match immediately their head tilt, head tilts and volume; those are the simplest because as soon as they open their mouths and start talking you can hear it…

Susan Bratton: Nice.

John Santangelo: Head tilts and volume, and start with that and practice with that. Pretty soon you’ll find yourself, “Wow this is actually really easy and it’s fun too.”

Susan Bratton: Yeah, it is fun. It really is fun. I’ve had such a good time John, and I know we went over and I hope we haven’t tested the limits of your listening for John and I to tell you all of these great things, but I hope it was worthwhile. And John, I really, really appreciate all that you’ve given, especially the freebies and the downloads and the worksheets and the, all that stuff. Thank you for it.

John Santangelo: It’s all about giving value.

Susan Bratton: Yeah, exactly. Over deliver. So good. Well, I am your host, Susan Bratton. You have gotten to hear more from John Santangelo. If you didn’t hear part one – this is a two part series – I really recommend you go back and listen to part one as well. It’s a nice system he’s created for us to learn more about the power of NLP, hypnotic language, creating repertoire and reaching our goals and getting out of our fear. It all sounds good to me; I’m going to keep working it, working it, working it. I’m your host, Susan Bratton. I hope you have a great day.