Episode 91 - Dr. Erika Thost: The Sexy Prostate

Transcript

Chip August: Welcome to Sex, Love and Intimacy. I’m your host, Chip August, and today on the show we are talking about the prostate, about the man’s g-spot, about the man’s sacred spot, and we are talking with Dr. Erika Thost. Dr. Erika Thost is an MD, she’s a general physician, and although she’s not in practice as a general physician these days, she teaches tantra, she teaches sexuality for middle aged men and middle aged women, she teaches techniques about prostate massage, she teaches techniques about g-spot massage. She is a staunch firm advocate of teaching us techniques to get joy and pleasure out of our bodies, and she’s just really great to listen to, she talks in a really direct simple way about things that many people carry shame about and a lot of us are curious about. We were talking before the show and we both agreed, you know, sex is a really good thing and it doesn’t really need any good excuses, you know. It’s just a good thing, so… Welcome to the show Dr. Erika Thost.

Dr. Erika Thost: Thank you Chip. We’ve got a great topic for today.

Chip August: We do. And I want to just sort of jump right into this thing, okay. So, so first I just want to say to listeners, we’re talking about anus’s, we are talking about asses, we are talking about prostate, we’re talking… And for, we’re going to talk pretty explicitly and pretty directly. I’ve asked Dr. Erika to really be direct on this. We don’t really need to mince words, and so I just want you to know that. So, first you’re an MD, you’re a general physician. Out of curious how’d you get involved with like prostate massage and g-spot massage?

Dr. Erika Thost: Well I had the same feeling that most people do about the word ‘prostate’, which is when you’re young it’s not very interesting, and when you’re older it’s trouble. So I was really surprised once during a sexual exploration having a finger on a male prostate during his ejaculatory orgasm, and the prostate poofs out. It expands and then contracts back down. And this is not something, and I went to a really good medical school, this is not something that anyone had ever mentioned. And that’s when I began to get curious and thought there’s more to this than we think.

Chip August: So it actually kind of puffed up and then shrunk down, huh? It actually like expanded and…. Was it like a contraction or would it like get bigger and bigger and bigger slowly, or…?

Dr. Erika Thost: It really, I keep using the word ‘poofs’ because it is a very sudden move out, and my sense now is that it’s the moment where the guy thinks, “Oh, I’m going to cum”. It’s that moment of inevitiability. And the really interesting thing is I’ve talked to a couple of urologists about this and they weren’t about to admit that they didn’t know this, but they looked kind of surprised.

Chip August: Yeah, right, right, ‘cause it’s about sex and it’s about pleasure, and there just isn’t a lot that’s about medicine that’s about sex and pleasure. Thank goodness you’re doing this. Thank you. Alright, so you’re with a partner, you discover that there’s this sexual response, you start to get more interested in this response. I want to backtrack a little bit because I know some listeners know exactly what we’re talking about, and for some listeners they’re already lost. So tell me a little bit about what is the prostate, where is it in a man, what does it have to do with sex?

Dr. Erika Thost: Okay. So, the prostate is inside the anal opening. Basically, and we’ll talk later about how to do this because you only do it with great respect and utmost caution. However, when you slide a finger up the anal opening, you will run into a little flat firm surface about the size of a quarter. And what I tell people is when you get really fancy with this and you’re all pretzeled up in a tantric position, and believe it or not it happens to everybody. You’ve got your finger in there and you go, “Now where is it? Which way?” So just remember it’s kind of attached to the penis, those tissues are attached. So if you can locate his penis, you can locate on which side of his rectum the prostate is going to be.

Chip August: So you’re putting a finger in a man’s butt, up all the way. It’s pretty deep, it’s not near the entrance, it’s not just right inside, it’s fairly deep, yes?

Dr. Erika Thost: Well the lower edge can be pretty close in, which can be good news if you’re worried about messiness in the play. So you can get to the prostate pretty easily. However, to reach the upper edge, especially if you have small hands like I do, it can be a bit of a stretch and it’s not, the whole thing is not something you push, you don’t rush up there.

Chip August: But then if you had your finger inside and you, it was as if you tried to point at the penis when you were inside, you’d probably find it right about there.

Dr. Erika Thost: That’s exactly right. And the other thing to remember is you want to touch it, to begin with, so lightly, especially if you have a glove on, that you can’t even feel that you’re touching it, and it’s possible that the guy’s going to go “Hhaa, hhaa, that’s enough. That’s too much.” And then there’s some guys who’ll say, “Oh my god, where have you been all my life baby? Bring it on. Bring it on.” And actually there’s a caution there too that some guys just go nuts with this, actually more than one would think, and they will ask to have it be really intense, really hard motion, and that’s where the giver has to be in charge and protective of the receiver, and up the energy, maybe with words, sexy words, “I’m doing this, you’re loving it. I’m going to do you.” But they don’t make the movement a whole lot harder. The tissues are still fragile, the exploration may still be new, and you do not want to be sorry about it the morning after.

Chip August: So, it’s also my experience that, personally, that at the beginning of this kind of play, everything is kind of tight and closed down, I’m going to need a lot of lubrication, but as my body relaxes and as my body gets more used to having something inside me, there’s also a little more firmness that feels good, that there’s a way, there’s a different behavior I want you to do in the first minute or two that we’re doing this than I want you to do after we’ve been doing this for ten or fifteen minutes.

Dr. Erika Thost: There’s definitely a warming up process, mega, mega warming up process, and then the endorphins do kick in and that’s when you don’t want to get too rough. And also the other thing is when you first push in you also want to be super, super slow.

Chip August: Now if it feels so pleasant and it’s up there in the anal canal, how come I don’t get like little mini orgasms when I have a big poop?

Dr. Erika Thost: I think it’s possible. I haven’t asked a lot of people about it, but I think it’s definitely something to think about, cause, you know, that narrows, that toy or sexual tool, it’s basically an exquisitely differently shaped butt plug with two little rings that keep it from getting sucked up inside, and when men have that inside and they contract, they will feel pressure against their prostate and my guess is it should be similar with a bowel movement.

Chip August: So it may be that one of the reasons that that large bowel movement feels so good is that actually it’s doing this sort of gentle prostate massage as it moves through our body, that’s an interesting thought.

Dr. Erika Thost: Why not enjoy it all.

Chip August: Okay, now we’re talking a little bit about poops, so lets talk about poop for a minute, okay. So some of us have this idea of if I put a finger up my butt I’m going to be poking right into put. Is that what happens?

Dr. Erika Thost: A lot of the time it is, yes. And that’s what keeps people from doing anal play a lot of the time, and it’s something to be dealt with. There are several ways of dealing with. It, you can try cleaning out, and we can talk about that. You can try just, you know, ban the torpedoes, or damn the torpedoes full speed ahead. Or you can just go inside a little bit and, okay this is where we get graphic… If there’s some firm pieces in there, you just take your finger and push them out of the way and go about your business.

Chip August: Yeah, so some of this is getting used to… I actually, the whole idea that poop is so terrible is something, I try to teach people all poop is is the part of the food that our body didn’t need, and so in some ways our anus is just the bottom end of our throat. And I’m not suggesting that we should eat any of that, but I am suggesting that the idea that it’s disgusting or terrible or awful is an idea, and mostly I think comes from toilet training, but lets get real here. All this is is it’s what’s left of the food after our body’s taken all the good stuff and it’s just the other end of our throat, and if we could maybe let go of some of that “Eww” sensation, there’s a lot of pleasure that can be had there.

Dr. Erika Thost: I totally agree. And in fact one thing that sometimes surprises people, that the germs that are down there are not actually super dreadful germs. If you’re intimate with somebody, those germs are all over the place already anyway, and so it’s nice to be clean, it’s nice to take a shower, but if there is an urge for a quickie and you haven’t had a shower and you don’t have a wipie handy, go for it. What’s more important is to have fun. And cleanliness is not more important than having fun.

Chip August: But it’s also my experience, I have to say that if my bowel movements have been kind of firm and not soft and often when my partners play anally with me, they don’t, they don’t get poop. There’s not, you know, mostly that anal canal is sitting, it’s just kind of sitting there, it’s not, there’s nothing in it at all.

Dr. Erika Thost: Lots of times there isn’t. Or lots of times there’s just a little bit up high. The part that sometimes gets frustrating for me is reading a lot of the published materials that go on about the party line, which is that normally the rectum is free of any kind of fecal matter, that it’s higher up, and then when you get the urge to go is when it descends, and then you go to the bathroom and you poop it out and you’re done, and a lot of the time it is that way but not nearly all of the time. You will run across some poop. And, you know, to echo what you just mentioned, it really isn’t the end of the world. You can use gloves, you know, if you don’t like the smell on your hand, you can have wipies handy, and if you want to be really elegant you can have one of those big ziplock bags handy, and as you use those things you put them in the bag and zip it up because for a lot of us the smell is not that much of a turn-on, whereas dealing with cleaning it up is like nothing.

Chip August: Well this seems like a strange moment to take a break, but we need to take a break here. So listeners, we’re about to hear some messages from our sponsors, and I’d really like you to listen to these ads. They’re created by my sponsors for my show, and they help me bring my work to you, and if you can support my sponsors, why, I really appreciate it. I get credit for whatever you utilize. It helps grow the show, and there’s a lot of, there’s a lot of really good deals for you. If you haven’t checked, you ought to go take a look at the personallifemedia.com episode pages where some of, there are some dollar deals, you know, twenty percent off this and fifty percent off that that are definitely worth checking out that you get just for being a listener to the show. While you’re there you might notice that there is a place for a survey, and if you would just take five minutes and fill out our anonymous listeners survey, it will help me understand who’s listening to the show and also helps me sell the show to sponsors. So it does me a service, and also it helps me create shows just for you. So go visit the episode pages at personallifemedia.com, just look for the show Sex, Love and Intimacy and please listen to these messages, and we’ll be right back.

Chip August: Welcome back to Sex, Love and Intimacy. I’m your host Chip August. We’re talking to Erika Thost, Dr. Erika Thost. She’s an MD, a general physician  and a tantra teacher and an expert on sexuality for middle aged folks and we’re talking mostly about prostate right now. And when we left we were talking a little bit about, you know, whether you were going to encounter poop or not. I also want to talk a little bit about sort of is it, is it dangerous. You keep talking about being cautious and being so… So what’s sort of the risk level here of getting hurt with having somebody push in to this area of my body where mostly I just push things out?

Dr. Erika Thost: Well there are some really delicate tissues. The anus is a very complex structure, and it’s actually not meant for a lot of hard in and out, kind of fucking motion, it’s not really meant for that. A prostate massage ends up being more sliding a finger in and then moving the tip of the finger. So that’s contrary to a lot of people’s expectations. I do also really urge people to get their annual check-up and get their prostate checked, and if they’re going to do anything other than super light play, to get the okay from their physician, ‘cause you’d hate to have something be happening there that you don’t know about. And then in terms of actually doing it, first of all, the old saying of there’s no lube in the ass like there is in the pussy, so you want to use a lot of lube and then you want to use some more and after that you want to use still more. And actually there’s some technical parts about how to use lube and which kinds of lube. However, the big other caution is don’t ever surprise your guy by shoving a finger, anything else up him. It may make for a great fantasy on both your parts, may make for a great x-rated story, but it’s not something you want to ever do. You want to always, always, always ask him in words, unless you know him really well, “Is it okay if I come in?” And in fact, you know, guys who are doing a g-spot massage, or even having sexual intercourse with women, for them to ask, “May I come in?”, oh my god, it’s going to melt the woman’s heart. So anyway, to ask, “May I come in?”, to wait for the answer, and to make sure that the answer was yes before coming in. If you surprise him and shock him, he is not ever going to forget that and relax ever again.

Chip August: Well I also want to make a distinction here. I think it is plenty surprising to place your finger on the outside of an anus. That is right away for many men, for many people, for many women, a lot of us don’t even know if we like anal play or not. Maybe we’ve read about it, maybe we’ve thought about it. That moment that somebody actually has a finger even on the outside of the anus, really that’s plenty surprising, that’s really going to create the conversation. That’s a great place to then stop and see if there’s anything more that’s wanted.

Dr. Erika Thost: Exactly, and Body Electric and those other places teach those wonderful anal massage techniques, and there’s a world of pleasure to be had just with external. However, in order for the receiver to really enjoy that massage, they have to know, again, that they’re not going to be surprised, and then they can relax and enjoy the external pleasure.

Chip August: This by the way I think is good advice for anybody who’s ever being sexual with any other person in any way. I actually think permission is sexy, and I think unless you’ve agreed in advance what the permissions are and now you’re pretending to take what you’ve already got permission for, I just think permission is sexy. Now listen, I’m a guy. I discover I have a partner who plays with my anus, and what I discover is when my partner puts their finger up my butt, all of the sudden my erection starts to get soft. What does that mean? Am I, does that mean I don’t really like it? What does that mean?

Dr. Erika Thost: That is, that Chip is totally normal. So what we like to do with the prostate or male g-spot massage is we like to start out with genital pleasure. You’re massaging his penis, a female or male partner is massaging his penis and there’s also Fire on the Mountain and wonderful information out there about how to do that. And there’s a difference between genital massage, which is the idea is prolonged pleasure, versus a hand job, which is also great, but that’s not what we’re talking about right now. And then when the pleasures going, he’s happy, he’s aroused, then we start to introduce the finger with the permission, and often, yes, the erection… Well all along, erection is allowed to come and go. That is just how human beings work.  However, when a finger or something moves in, typically the erection will fade a little bit just because the focus is different, and that doesn’t mean he’s not liking it, ‘cause he’s probably loving it, and it doesn’t mean he’s not turned on, doesn’t mean he doesn’t love you anymore, it just means that that’s what the body does. And after that the erection may come back and come and go and he’s having a good time.

Chip August: Now when my, when I go in for my annual physical, I’m of an age where my GP will put on a rubber glove and stick a finger deep inside me to massage my prostate to get some fluid out. I don’t get turned on. It’s not really, it’s not really hot for me. It kind of seems abrupt and… So why would I want to play, you know, like if that’s my only experience of prostate, why would I want to play with prostate?

Dr. Erika Thost: Some guys do like their annual prostate massage, I mean prostate exam. But no, it’s not set up for that and it’s not conducive to that, and I think a doctor would be uncomfortable if you were overtly enjoying it. And well, in setting, I think we’re talking about a whole different atmosphere here, we’re talking about permission. And actually here’s some advice for women and also men who have sex with men; in my experience pretty much every guy in the world, if it’s safe enough and if he knows he’s not going to be made fun of, pretty much every guy in the world is curious about this kind of thing. It doesn’t mean he wants it, it doesn’t mean he wants it right now, but he’s curious and he would love to talk about it, and he would love to have it be a topic that’s on the table.

Chip August: Yeah, I think it’s, I, you know, listeners who know I lead workshops in love, intimacy and sexuality all over the world, and it is definitely a question I frequently ask rooms full of people; you know, how many of you already know that you like anal play, that you like anal insertion, that you like to give and receive this? And always, you know, two-thirds to three-quarters of the hands sheepishly go up, and then everybody looks around and laughs because they all thought only, you know, five hands in the room would go up, and it turns out there’s a lot of very pleasurable nerve endings in that part of the body that people enjoy. Alright, so one of the things that straight guys are often afraid of is if I like having somebody play with my anus, doesn’t that really mean I’m gay?

Dr. Erika Thost: So sexual orientation has to do with who you are attracted to. It does not have to do with what areas of your body give you pleasure. And if you talk to any of the sales people in any of the sex shops, they will tell you that the hottest item is for a heterosexual couple to come in to buy the strap-on equipment so that she can do him. Most guys on some level love some kind of anal play, and that totally includes straight guys.

Chip August: Okay. Now my experience is when my prostate is being played with, certainly the first time, what it felt to me like was that without any stroking of my dick suddenly it felt like I had like a jolt run through me as if I wanted to cum, as if I wanted to ejaculate. And that’s sort of, that’s sort of, I want that experience again and again and again, that’s what, that’s what’s really great. Is that pretty typical? Is that what men mostly report to you about? I mean, is that why guys like this?

Dr. Erika Thost: I think you were especially lucky. There are two parts to that; one is, one of the reasons I am passionate about the prostate is that I think there is a gateway there to a whole other male sexuality. And to tell you the truth I think it’s a male sexuality that’s been neglected. I think men have not gotten the nurturing and the information, for example, that women have gotten around their g-spots, and that’s part of my mission, is to be on Oprah talking about the male g-spot, because there is a lot of pleasure to be had there, and there’s the potential for that different kind of orgasm. And also which may or may not require an erection. So there’s a lot of possibilities there for people on different levels of functioning.

Chip August: Whew, okay. The room seems to be getting warmer. I keep telling you more things about my sexuality than I meant to say. Okay. So, so we know a lot of men like this. We know that a lot of women like giving this. I always think that there’s also a piece of it that’s very, very, very psychological, that there’s so much of my male sexuality that’s tied up in thrusting, inserting, rather than receiving. And this is an act where I’m receiving, but I’m still getting intense pleasure in my genitals, and that psychological switch has a whole sexual component to it also.

Dr. Erika Thost: That’s so exactly right, and this is part of what I just love about this topic is that there’s two parts to it. It can be really hot. Because say you’re a heterosexual couple, you get to do that gender reversal. I’m doing you. The woman, you know, whether it’s with a strap-on, or actually fingers are much easier to do than a strap-on, but she’s doing him. She’s in charge, she’s putting energy out and he’s receiving and receptive. So there’s the heat of that and the turn-on of that. And then at the same time there’s this amazing nurturing part of it too. “I love you so much that I want to just lay you down and do you inside and out, and you can just trust me and I will be totally there for you, and you can receive in a way you may have never received before.”

Chip August: Okay, now I’m all turned on, we got to take a break. Okay, so we’re going to take a short break here. Listeners if you enjoy the show, and I know you do, would you please send links to your friends, let them know about this show. I really want to grow my audience, you know. We’re reaching tens and tens of thousands of people, but I want to reach hundreds of thousands of people, so if you like what you’re hearing please send links to people and let them hear it also. Also if you notice that there’s something Erika just said or something I said and you think, “I need to cut and paste that and put it up on my wall”, well I want you to know that we transcribe almost every episode, and so you can find a transcription and maybe mail a quote to somebody to get them interested or maybe actually mail a quote to your sweetie and say, “What do you think? Want to try this tonight?”, and it’s just one more way that you can get value from these show. We’re going to take a short break. Please listen to these messages. I’m Chip August. We’re talking about prostates, and we’ll be right back.

Chip August: Welcome back to Sex, Love and Intimacy. I’m your host Chip August. I’m talking on today’s show with Dr. Erika Thost. We’ve been talking about prostates and prostate pleasuring and all kinds of, everything to do with male g-spot that we can think of to talk about. So tell me, if, given so many men like it and given that so many women like it, what do you figure is like one of the big obstacles that stops couples from playing with this?

Dr. Erika Thost: Okay, assuming we’re talking about a heterosexual couple here, I think a lot of women have trouble with a butt, that’s anything other than really super squeaky clean. And super squeaky clean may mean soaping it in the shower more than once. I’m a, like I said, I’m a big proponent of quickies, but that’s later when you’re used to each other, when she’s really into it. If she’s just tentatively exploring, you know what, you’re in the shower, you’ve washed, and I’ve just read that somewhere online, you run your finger up your butt and you actually… Okay, that is getting really graphic, you actually sniff it, and if you smell some bad smell, you soap it again and you repeat the check again. And believe me, your gal is going to thank you for that. And then there’s a whole other issue of hair that can make more of a scent and can make it easy, harder to get it clean, and I’ve done lots of research and exploration about how to deal with pubic hair and that would be a whole other show.

Chip August: Well, so, so lets say people want to get in touch with you, ‘cause obviously there’s so much more we can talk about, about the prostate and about men and about hair and about all kinds of things. How could people find out more about what you do and learn more about you or be in touch with you?

Dr. Erika Thost: I have a website, and it’s called sexyprostate.com. And I picked that name because people rarely think of the prostate as sexy, and my mission in life is to change that. So I want you to think of a sexy prostate and you can think of me. And on there I have a CD set for sale, of course, it’s audio so you can put it on your iPod, listen to it in your car, while you’re working out. And it has information that we could not get to today, and I’m actually really proud of it. There are parts of information on there, actually quite a few parts, that literally I could not find anywhere else, on how to clean out for anal play, the details on making it pleasurable for him, the health benefit question, and just how to do it and make it work, and anal part also for the women. And so I’m actually really proud of it, and I’m happy to offer it there.

Chip August: Thank you. And listeners, of course we’re going to put the link to that site on the episode page. So if you download your stuff from the iTunes music store, the Apple music store, you might also want to while you’re online, you might also want to just go to personallifemedia.com, look for the episode page for Sex, Love and Intimacy where you’ll find a bio on Dr. Erika and you’ll find the link to her site and you’ll find the transcript. While you’re fiddling around online you might want to drop me a line. You can send me comments, criticism, ideas for new shows, to [email protected]. I love hearing from you. I love, I love getting ideas about shows. Many of my shows come from your suggestions, so by all means, give me your suggestions. I want to say a moment about anal health, just be… First I want to say there’s a wonderful series on male genital massage called Fire in the Mountain, there’s, on female genital massage, Fire in the Valley, on anal play and anal massage called I think Anal Play For Health and Pleasure, all by a guy named Dr. Joseph Kramer. If you haven’t found those DVD’s, go look online, buy those DVD’s. They are just terrific, they just teach you terrific techniques over and above what Dr. Erika’s saying. But I also want to say one other thing, which is that people who have hemorrhoids often will pay a lot of money to have people just softly gently massage with a little bit of moisturizer or with a little bit of cortisone, or cortisone cream, they get these things massaged, and a lot of anal play is actually exactly that same technique. And so I want to say, people worry, “Well will this, you know, will this give me hemorrhoids?”, and my experience is actually exactly the opposite, that this is, one of the nice things about this is that as you put some pressure and you massage that area, you actually heal and soothe what was unhealed and unsoothed, so it’s a healthy thing to do. Which all brings me to, Dr. Erika, I like to ask my guests if they have an exercise that people can try at home that might bring more love, intimacy and sexuality in their lives, and so what would you suggest people do around your subject?

Dr. Erika Thost: Yeah, that is, I do want to talk about that. Just let me say about keeping the anal opening healthy and the prostate healthy, I think a little bit of loving attention is so much better than what we’ve been doing as a society, and I’m sure nothing but good can come of it. And I’ve actually also checked with quite a few urologists, and they agree with me, although there are no studies. And again, you know, you want to be careful. So the way to start doing some lovely anal play, and this, remember this is an equal opportunity territory for men and women… If someone is very skittish and they really don’t want you right there on your butt, a great way to start is massaging their glutes, the buns. Those are big muscles. They tend to hold a lot of tension and stress and also a lot of emotions ‘cause they’re down there by your butt. So you can really get in there, watching for fingernails, with some cream or dry, with a little cornstarch, and really knead those muscles, and let your partner know that you’re okay being down there. And then again with their permission you can sort of zero in on the point of interest, as we’ve been talking about, again reassuring them that you will not surprise them by sliding inside, reassuring them that you will stay outside until they request it, and as Joseph Kramer and his crowd says, “The ass will suck you in when it’s ready.” So until then you just gently, with a lot of lube, maybe with some gloves, you play on the outside and you know, remember prostate massage is a great thing and that’s not the goal. The goal is for you two to be having fun, to be having intimacy, to be exploring together and building your relationship that way. You don’t have to get anywhere, you’re already there, if you just do even the tiniest little bit of it for three minutes.

Chip August: And I want to say to those of you that don’t have a partner, this is an exercise you can do by yourself. This is definitely an exercise, with your own hand on your own buns, you can, first you can actually massage your own cheeks, and second, I really encourage people… It’s funny we, in our toilet training somehow we begin to believe that a part of us is dirty, and I actually think for our emotional health, as much as anything else, it’s really great to understand the difference between ‘this gets rid of waste products’ and ‘this is shameful’, and that I just think if we, you know, use your finger, do exactly what Dr. Erika said, but just do it to yourself and notice, notice the sensations, notice the sensations. You might want to try when you’re masturbating. You might want to notice if you’re masturbating with one hand and just gently kind of playing with that rosebud with the other, just notice.

Dr. Erika Thost: Yeah, I totally agree. You got it.

Chip August: So I want to thank you Dr. Erika. This has been a great show. I think you’re doing a great public service out there, healing the nation one asshole at a time. I think it’s a terrific goal. And thank you so much for being a guest on the show.

Dr. Erika Thost: That was really fun question Chip. Thanks.

Chip August: It’s my pleasure. And thank you listeners. Thank you for listening. I really appreciate your support. I hope you’ll join me again next time, but for now that’s the end of another episode of Sex, Love and Intimacy. Good-bye for now.