Episode 7: Specific Actionable Strategies with Robert Harrison
Specific Actionable Strategies with Robert Harrison, Founder of Professional's Edge
Announcer: This program is brought to you by personallifemedia.com.
Jason McClain: Welcome to Coaching the Life Coach. I'm Jason McClain. And today we are going to be talking about clear action strategies.
Robert Harrison: It’s so OK to have normal, what a lot of people call shallow, desires. They are great. I just got a new set of golf clubs and they are really nice golf clubs. It makes it a lot easier to hit a better swing and I love that. It feels great.
However, it's not the end-all and be-all.
Robert Harrison: A lot of people have an idea of something they want to work on, a goal they want to achieve. They are in their career and they want to get ahead. And yet, part of really prioritizing your life is really about figuring out what's most important.
Robert Harrison: So, I will give you a common example. I will go into a workshop with 150 or 200 people. The first question I will ask everyone is, “Why are you working?” And of course, there is this dead silence around the room for a while. Of course, finally, eventually someone will jump in and say, “For the money.”
Jason McClain: Our guest is Robert Harrison with Professional’s Edge. Welcome Robert. I'm glad to have you.
Robert Harrison: Thank you Jason.
Jason McClain: Robert is known for patience, persistence, and presence. I am pleased to have you with us today. We will be talking about prioritizing your life, arguing with reality - I can't wait to talk about that one - and then clear action strategies to grow your transformational practice.
So for each of those subjects as usual we will be talking about what they are, why they are important to you, how you can implement them into your life as well as what it will make possible in your life.
So Robert, first I would like to ask you a few questions about this concept of prioritizing your life. I know that you have worked with a lot of the major technological companies in the Bay area, such as Oracle and NEC and others. I'm curious, what is prioritizing your life and how does that work?
Robert Harrison: Well, one of the things that makes what we do at Professionals Edge that unique is we take a slightly different approach to prioritizing your life. Now a lot of people have an idea of something they want to work on or a goal they want to achieve. They are in their career and they want to get ahead. And yet, part of really prioritizing your life is really about figuring out what's most important.
A lot of times what is really fascinating is when a person comes in for an intake or an evaluation, and I will always ask them, “What’s the most important thing that you can do to improve the overall quality of your life?” They will always have a pretty good idea. And there's no doubt that if they were to do that it would definitely increase the quality of their life in some dimension.
However, to give you an example, one of the things we will do is we will then go through. I use a wheel of life. There are eight core different life areas. And then I will say, after I get their input, “Whom else do you know whose opinion you would deeply respect and that you would deeply appreciate and that you would trust?” So inevitably they will say something like my wife or my husband or a particular mentor in their past.
I say, “Now let's imagine that they were here right now. In fact, let's even role-play like you are they. And imagine that they are looking at you and looking at your life. They are not in your own skin. They don't have the same fears, concerns or worries that you have. They are looking from an outside point of view in. And what would they say is the most important area of your life that if you spent a little bit of time, or you addressed or set some goals in, would really improve the overall quality of your life the most?”
What's really unique is that quite often, I would say about 85% of the time or more it is something totally different than what they had originally come up with. And it's mind blowing.
So in terms of prioritizing your life, it is really ultimately about figuring out what is most important, what's really most important. Not just in terms of getting ahead but in creating a life that's thriving and a life that is sustainable. And one of the things that I really like to let people in the high-tech community especially know, is that you can't get ahead if your life isn't balanced or of it's not sustainable. The average person can't work 90 hours a week every week of their lives until they are 50 and still expect to have good health and still expect to have a good relationship with people that they love or be in an environment that is suitable to maintain longevity.
So really prioritizing your life with our direction is always organic. It's always about the person figuring out what is most important for them, but really doing it in a very grounded fashion so that they create a life that not only helps them achieve the goals that they have for themselves but do it in a way that is sustainable and that supports the rest of their life really thriving.
Jason McClain: Fantastic. Thanks Robert. So you have mentioned a little bit more. Can you say a little bit more about balance in the different areas of their life that you encourage people to balance?
Robert Harrison: Sure. So in terms of life balance, there are a million different ways to look at what creates a thriving and what creates a sustainable life. A really common way that we start with is just a very basic wheel of life. There are eight slices in it. And just to give you an idea, one slice might be your career. One slice might be your money or your financial picture. Another slice would be your romance. Another one would be your friends and family. Another one would be your personal growth. Another one would be fun and recreation. Then there is environment. That's where you live and where you spend your time, the clothes you are in and the car you are in, all that kind of stuff. All these things affect the quality of the life.
There are a million different ways to divide that up but essentially what we are looking for is creating the life in such a way where everything supports the highest quality experience over the longest period of time. What we find is that if your focus is mostly on the career, to get the house, to take care of the family, to do all that kind of stuff, and if you are so ultra focused on that, that your family falls to the wayside, you kind of missed the point.
We also use a concept of the goal, the goal, which really helps people understand the point of balance. So, I will give you a common example. I will go into a workshop with 150 or 200 people. The first question I will ask everyone is, “Why are you working?” And of course, there is this dead silence around the room for a while. Of course, finally, eventually someone will jump in and say, “For the money.”
And I will say, “Yes, for the money.” And then everyone will chime in with that. There is a lot of shame around it, “Oh my God, if I am just in it really for the money, what does that mean about me?” But then what I will say to them is, “Yeah, let's play this out. Now, if you could get the money, whatever that is to you, what would that make possible?”
Quite often a person will yell, “Well, you know, I would go to the Caribbean!” And another person will yell, “I would get the Jaguar!” Another person will yell, “I would get the house!” I do this. I would do that. All right?
I say, “Great.” So we put that on the board and I say, “Great, now let's say we really all got all that. Can everyone buy into that?” Everyone is getting excited at this point. I say, “Now what would that make possible?” “It would be even better.”
Quite often at that point people will start to go, “Hmm, I never really thought about it. Well I would be able to provide better for my house. I would feel like I was more successful. I would have more recognition and more accomplishments.” Etc. etc. I say, “Great, great. And what's even more important than that? What would that make possible?”
What we are doing here is connecting up these drives that we all have been really helping a person to understand why they're doing it in the first place. It's like the difference between the means and the ends. A lot of times we are so focused on accomplishing the means that we forget to look at the end result that we were doing it for the first place.
Jason McClain: We drop the context so we forget what is really important to us in life and what our true values are that should be fulfilled through the work.
Robert Harrison: Exactly. Exactly. So part of really getting your life in balance is connecting all those things. It’s so OK to have normal, what a lot of people call shallow, desires. They are great. I just got a new set of golf clubs and they are really nice golf clubs. It makes it a lot easier to hit a better swing and I love that. It feels great.
However, it's not the end-all and be-all. The whole point is what is going to help my life be the most balanced and most sustainable and thrive the most over the longest period of time? That's like a way, not that you can measure happiness, but the closest kind of metric to that - the highest quality experience over the longest period of time.
So when you really start to connect people up with that, you get up to these higher levels where it's like the money gets me the house, the house gets me the acknowledgment and gets me the recognition, it gets me the peace of mind, it gets me feeling OK. So when a person really gets connected up with that suddenly they are able to start to put that in perspective. They start to adjust their behavior so that in the pursuit of that ultimate goal they don't miss sight of what they are going after in the first place.
Jason McClain: Excellent. Thanks Robert. That's great. I'm curious, what does it make possible in people's lives when they really start to prioritize their life and they start to connect up to those higher, deeper values? What does it make possible in their life or their health or their relationships or their career or their sex? [Laughs]
Robert Harrison: Quite simply, it helps them thrive more in that area. When I say thrive, imagine a flower or a plant and if you give the plant just the right amount of sunlight, not too much, but not too little, just the right kind of soil, not too much and not too little, nutrient rich in just the right amount of water, it balloons and it reaches its fullest potential. That's exactly what that means.
By getting really clear, clarity on what is actually most important and what is actually the clear actionable strategy - I don't want to get ahead of myself but to get really clear on that - what it does is allow a person to go through and prune different areas of their lives, drop off the things they are doing that are clearly not working towards that ultimate goal and adjust the things that they are doing so that they get even better results.
Jason McClain: Perfect. Very clear. Thank you.
We are going to take a short break to support our sponsors. I'm Jason McClain. I am here with Robert Harrison of Professional’s Edge and we will be right back.
Jason McClain: Welcome back. I am your host Jason McClain. Again I am here with Robert Harrison.
Before we left we were talking about prioritizing your life and making sure that you have balance in your life. Next I would like to talk to you about this concept of arguing with reality. I love that. Can you talk to me about that Robert? What is arguing with reality?
Robert Harrison: There is a long and a short answer to arguing with reality. I'll start with the short one. It is summed up in a quote by a woman named Byron Katie who is a philosopher and a spiritual teacher. It goes like this, “When you argue with reality you lose, but only always.”
Let me give you an example.
Jason McClain: [laughs] That’s great!
Robert Harrison: Let me give you an example. If you don't want it to be raining outside, and yet it is raining and you make this decision in your mind, and we do this a lot at the unconscious level - take a wedding day for example, “I'm not going to be happy unless it is clear and sunny on my wedding day.” The wedding day comes along and it's raining. Well, nine out of 10 people that go through that will suddenly get very miserable and very unhappy and have massive suffering.
What's happening here is that there are two realities. There is reality as it is, which is that it is raining. At least if you're in Monterey and it is raining in Monterey, then it is raining. That's pretty much an assessment a group of people could all agree on. And it is wet outside. There is this other reality, which is how I want things to be in my ideal world. Then of course between the two is a gap or this distance. If a person requires that reality, as it is, to match up with how they want things to be, and whenever it is not in alignment they will suffer.
The degree to which they will suffer is the degree to which there is a difference between those two realities.
Jason McClain: There are two quotes that come to mind for me. One is from a gentleman by the name of Richard Bandler who said, “Disappointment requires adequate preparation.” [Laughs] The other was an Eastern spiritual teacher who said, “All misery is the result of wanting things to be other than they are.”
Robert Harrison: Exactly. Exactly. So this is classically, if you look back in almost all traditions, this is the classic root cause of suffering. What we find is, and you can do it in a professional context or you can do it in the personal life context, the degree to which a person's life is not thriving in one particular area is the degree to which they are checking out. In other words, they are not allowing themselves to see things as they really are.
Why? Because they want to see things as they want them to be.
Jason McClain: So rather than having a close relationship with reality or as the famous Warner Earnhardt said, “Our relationship with what is so”, they have this relationship to their expectations, their disappointments as a result. Is that what you're saying?
Robert Harrison: Exactly. A very strong attachment. I think Warner Earnhardt was famous for always saying, “Rocks are hard. Water is wet. And then fill in the blank.”
Jason McClain: [laughs]
Robert Harrison: So you can be hanging out with someone and they could go, “Oh so-and-so did this to me again. Why did they do it to me again?” I'd say, “Well, rocks are hard. Water is wet. And they do that thing they do.” Right? These are the mystical dance moves that we all have.
So the basic concept with this is that when we are not present with reality as it is, when we are not really present, in other words when you're not patiently and persistently present with what is, when you don't allow yourself to see things as they actually are, what you're doing is in essence, kind of checking out. The degree to which you check out is the degree to which you will suffer. And they are directly proportional.
The degree to which you bring patience, persistence and presence into any area of your life is the degree to which you will thrive in that area.
Jason McClain: So, how do you assist people in closing that gap and in having a more profound relationship to reality, rather than their internal desires? And also, how do you balance that with actually going for that change? Ron Dawe said, “Everything in the universe is permanent including my desire to change it.” So how do you close that gap and not have misery?
Robert Harrison: Well, there is a process. And there are stages. There is an old saying that says, “First there is attention. After attention follows awareness. And after awareness follows action.”
So the very first thing you need to do with the person who is suffering in this way is really help them understand the concept of these two realities. That's got to be the foundational piece, right? To give you an example, take a smoker. There are a lot of smokers. I smoked for 20 years. They will lie to themselves about the reality of what smoking is actually doing to themselves. They don't want to look at it. They don't want to feel it. They don't want to think about it. They don't want to acknowledge it.
We do this in every area of our life. We do it at work. We do it in relationships. There are certain things that are uncomfortable that we don't want to feel. So the result of that is, when we don't allow ourselves to look at it, reality doesn't care.
I like to tell my clients that I could walk out into the middle of the 101 with my hands over my eyes and try to pretend that there are no cars going down the highway. The reality of it is that I will probably be hit by a car. So one of the first things we do, and this is where the wheel of life really comes in. It helps them bring attention into these really core critical life areas. By bringing its attention and by bringing attention to that, the awareness starts to grow. OK?
There is a whole strategy about how to do that but that's just the first preliminary step. Once that awareness comes and they start to see what's working and what's not working and to be honest with themselves about it, then, at that point, we can eventually move on to a clear actionable strategy.
Jason McClain: I think we actually have time to talk a little bit more about how you assist them in closing that gap, if you're willing.
Robert Harrison: So, one of the first things we do, again the first part of closing the gap as I said is to go through the wheel of life and to help them identify the areas of their life in which they are perhaps checking out and not being present to. Then what we want to do is give them a set of practices just create awareness in the beginning. That's all that's necessary.
Jason McClain: What types of practices are those?
Robert Harrison: A common example would be a client coming into the office. Their finances are in complete disarray. The credit card debt is piling up. They have just taken out a second mortgage on their house maybe trying to refinance a business or something like that. There is this particular client that I'm thinking about.
So one of the things I will do is have them put on a sheet of paper all of their debt and have them sketch it out on one sheet of paper. It's really simple, just all of their debt and all of their income, and then their monthly burn rate. I will just have them get that on one sheet of paper.
Of course, when I give them that assignment, I will tell you the effect of that in a moment, but when I give them that assignment, here's what I tell them. I say, “I want you to go and do this. The first thing is I want you to become aware of and notice is that you don't want to do it. You don't want to sit down and take a look at it, especially if your finances are in disarray.”
Jason McClain: That’s right.
Robert Harrison: Exactly. When a person's finances are in disarray most of the time they don't want to look at it. They have not been present with it. They haven't patiently and persistently been present with it. So what I have them do is get out that sheet of paper and I say, “Here is the assignment. Your assignment is, once you have it on the sheet of paper, which is the first challenge and the first step, to then look at it twice a week.”
And here's the challenge I tell them, I say, “I have never come across a client who, if you accept the challenge that I'm about to give you, has not transformed their financial life in less than six months. And here's all you have to do. You get your debt, your income and your burn rate all on one sheet of paper and you look at it twice a week, no matter how much it stings, no matter how much you don't want to do it, force yourself even for a couple of minutes, twice a week. If you do that after a period of six months, your financial future will be radically different.”
Why? Because what we are doing is patiently and persistently bringing gentle self-honest awareness. That means not beating yourself up. Remember we have a saying in NLP - there is no failure. There is only feedback. And beating yourself up by the way, doesn't ever work. What it actually does is cause the person to want to check out even more. So it is checking out from reality even more which just adds to the problems.
So if they commit to looking at those finances just twice a week, a simple practice like this - and this is what I call a performance hat. There is a performance hat for almost every core life area. If you really apply that, this one simple little thing, it will really transform that area of your life.
Now of course there are lots of other things we can do at much higher and complex levels but this is a very good example of starting place.
Jason McClain: Great. Fantastic. Perfect. Thanks. And then, I'm curious Robert, what does it open up in their life? You talked about transforming their finances in six months. Some of the other practices, which we don't have to get into now, but if you really close that gap between reality and what we want reality to be, or if we stop walking around on 101 with our eyes covered, what does it make possible in our relationships, our finances, our career. Again, please what does it make possible, open up for or allow for?
Robert Harrison: Well, the main thing that it makes possible is happiness, thriving. A person is not unhappy because they are overweight. The person is unhappy because they are overweight, which is the reality, and they don't want to be overweight.
Jason McClain: [laughs] That’s right. That's right. Exactly.
Robert Harrison: So this is where a core practice like meditation, and this is something that I do with almost all my clients, really comes into play. What's going on here is that the person in their mind, and it is so natural, the whole idea is that, “If I could just take off at 20 pounds” or “If I could just get those credit cards paid off, then I would be OK” or “If I could just get that relationship the way I want it to be or get that promotion at work then everything would work out. It would all be OK”
In reality, what's going on and what is actually preventing them from making that possible is their inability to be OK, right there, where they are at, as they are. So this core practice of meditation helps a person really practice being OK in the midst of things as they actually are.
Jason McClain: In the work that I do with clients one of the things I talk about is disidentification. So you have your finances but you are not your finances. You've got your political affiliation but you're not your political affiliation. You're not your sexuality, your gender, your upbringing, your race, or your ethnicity. You're not your nationality necessarily.
But you have all of that. And all that is fine. But it is the attachment to it as a chunk of identity that drives people to make choices that lead to misery.
Robert Harrison: Exactly, it's almost like each one is an individual investment, like a 401(k) for Okness.
Jason McClain: [laughs]
Robert Harrison: In the future. It's like, if I could at least get this area of my life this way, and this area of my life this way, and this area of my life this way, then I will be OK. The pathology is that underneath that the root of that is, “I’m not OK already, as is.” This is the beautiful thing about meditation. It allows the core consciousness, the deeper part of you that already is there, that already knows deep down that you're not all these things to start to organize itself around what it actually knows.
Then from the space goals suddenly become play. Getting ahead suddenly becomes fun. Actually losing weight and working out becomes more enjoyable because it's not like life-and-death anymore so you can actually do it in a way that is more organic, it's more flowing and it's more natural.
What's amazing is that this actually helps professionals progress farther up the chain, so to speak, then they ever could before actually by being more OK with things as they already are. It's so fascinating.
Jason McClain: Great. Fantastic. Thanks Robert.
We are going to take a short break to support our sponsors. I'm Jason McClain. I'm here with Robert Harrison talking about prioritizing your life and arguing with reality. We will be right back.
Jason McClain: We are back with Coaching the Life Coach. Before the break we were talking about prioritizing your life and arguing with reality, closing that gap between how you perceive or want reality to be an actually being profoundly, patiently and persistently present to reality.
Now Robert, I am curious to what do you attribute, what are the single most important distinctions or principles to which you attribute your success as a life coach? I know that not only have you worked with many of the big names in Silicon Valley but you have also worked with Montessori schools nationally and he worked with The Gap. So I am curious to what you attribute your success as a life coach?
Robert Harrison: Well Jason, success of course is an extremely subjective term. We all have different degrees and different stages of success in our mind. But in terms of the ability to really affect a large group of people; and one of my core principles is that I want to help others help themselves create a more meaningful life, whatever that means to them - to thrive and create a life that is sustainable.
So I think one of the things that has really made a huge difference for me is really applying my own principles. Being grounded and clear and getting clarity on what is actually most important and really having a vision for where I want to go. I think a lot of people do that but I think the other piece of that that is missing for a lot of coaches is that a clear vision is not enough. A clear vision is like the lighthouse for which you're aiming and then you need a clear actionable, grounded strategy, step-by-step plan of how to get there.
Jason McClain: So, could you describe what then a clear actionable strategy is? Other than just a step-by-step plan, but could you go into a little bit more detail about what that is?
Robert Harrison: Part of, in the context of building the coaching business, in terms of clear actionable strategy, is really taking a look at the market, understanding who your target client base is, and what their needs are, what their wants are, also understanding who else is out there offering similar services. For example, create a competitive advantage and distinguish yourself. And then find a way to communicate with your target market in a way that they actually understand.
Now, a lot of coaches that I know are brilliant. They are geniuses. They know more about personal development because they go so deeply into that, than the average person, yet there is this huge gap again between where they are at, and the average clients most pressing problem at that moment. If they don't understand that gap and adjust their message, so that the client gets what they need and they hear it in a way that they can understand and that makes sense to them, and that they can apply, then that message will be lost no matter how beautiful and wonderful it is. That's really important.
Jason McClain: Great. So then you just mentioned a few really important aspects I know for myself, that as I developed my coaching business were really critical. How would you suggest a life coach go about developing clear actionable strategies so that they can reach that vision that they have for their coaching business or practice?
Robert Harrison: That’s a great question. So obviously the first step is to get clear on what your vision is. Why are you going into business? What is it you wanted for yourself when you first set out going into business? Go through all those clarification questions. Once a person really gets clear on that, the next piece is to figure out what service they are offering, and then who their target market is and then find a way to actually communicate with that target market in a way that they will understand.
One of the greatest ways to do that is to test. Create an offer, a compelling offer. When I am coaching a coach I would have them step into their ideal client, once we get clear on what that is and then really take on the persona of that ideal client and go, “OK, here is where I am at. Here is how I get up in the morning. Here is what I eat for breakfast. Here's what my day is like. Here's what my life is like. I've got a wife. I've got the kids. I've got the demand of the job. I've got the Blackberry buzzing and all this stuff.” Really get into that. And then go, “Here are my needs. Here are my most pressing, burning desires right now. What kind of messages would actually get through to me?”
I believe we live in an attention deficit society. What I mean by that is that we are constantly being bombarded by information and offers and I think there are like 30 million publications produced per year. That's more than any person could possibly keep up with.
Jason McClain: I had read somewhere that we are exposed to nearly a million pieces of advertising a day in an urban environment.
Robert Harrison: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And those are just the deliberate ones.
Robert Harrison: So it's insane. This is where clarity, focus and being grounded really come into play. And I will tell you something else. This is a little secret of the trade so to speak that I would give to any coach. The number one way to go from vision into clear actionable strategy, and it sounds so counterintuitive is meditation, believe it or not.
Most coaches don't realize the resources they have within them. Of course, it's not enough to be a good therapist or a good coach or a good wiki person or a good massage person or whatever, you have to be a businessperson also. Not that you are that person but that you have those skills.
Once you get all those skills together and you have the necessary resources, and what is needed is clarity. What brings clarity is being grounded. And the best, most empirically proven way to do that is through meditation. Meditation will help a person start to take that vision and ground it and bring it down into reality, and be really honest with themselves.
Sometimes it might mean recognizing that maybe you can't do what it is you thought you could do for your client. One great way to find out is to interview your clients and see how well you are serving them. A lot of coaches don't do that.
Do research. A lot of coaches do not research their target market to find out what they really want and what they really need and what is really most important to them and pressing. If you don't do that, if you don't really know what your ideal client wants, how are you going to give it to him? How are you going to be of service to him?
Jason McClain: That’s right. That's right. So, what does it make possible for life coach if they have a clear actionable strategy so that they can get towards their vision, what does it make possible for their career and for them personally, for their own personal satisfaction professionally and otherwise?
Robert Harrison: If I had to sum it up into one word it would be acceleration. Acceleration toward thriving, in other words, the clearer they are on what their vision is, on what they actually want and their clear actionable strategy and how they are going to execute that step-by-step plan, the more enjoyable process is and the more relaxed they are going to be in a process. Because they have a system there that works for them, not that the system is the reality that the system provides a structure for that, and the more they are going to move towards that.
They are going to move towards that faster. They are going to move towards that in a more authentic way. And they are going to be more successful. I think the average consumer is getting much, much more savvy than ever before about unclear and confusing messages. With promises, people are not sure to what they are committing or what is being requested of them etc. so people are getting really much more discerning about the offers they actually pay attention to.
Part of that again is because we live within this attention deficit society and we are being bombarded. So the message is not crystal clear. If it doesn't address a clear and specific need, and a clear and specific need that is actually important person than it is not going to get through. That's the tough question that every coach has to ask himself. How can I bring what I bring to the world in a way that is clear, that is concise, that makes sense and that is actually wanted?
If you try to sell me a baby stroller, it does not matter how great you are at it, I am not going to buy it. Why? Because I do not have a child.
Jason McClain: [laughs] Great, Robert. It has been a pleasure having you here. I'm curious, so you obviously offer coaching. How can people reach you for coaching?
Robert Harrison: There are a couple of ways. You can call us directly at our office at 650-591-5327. My office manager Alyssa is great. She can field any questions and explain to people how the program works. We have a group-coaching program. We also have individual coaching. That is higher managerial, executive level coaching. And we also do corporate presentations and workshops and things like that nationally.
Jason McClain: Do you have any scheduled workshops coming up? Or are those private?
Robert Harrison: All our workshops are private. They are generally in-house corporate workshops. Currently we are not offering any group workshops. However we do any group-coaching program that we are going to be launching. That is going to be via Web, via the telephone and it will have movie slide presentations and things like that. Then of course we have individual services and that is basically on a per client interview basis.
Jason McClain: And that is through professionalsedge.com?
Robert Harrison: That is correct - professionalsedge.com.
Jason McClain: Great, Robert. Thanks for joining us.
Robert Harrison: Thanks Jason. It was a pleasure.
Jason McClain: That brings us to the end of our show. Thank you for listening. I'm your host Jason McClain, your guide in the 21st-century marketplace.
You can reach me at Jason@personallifemedia.com. Join us next week when our guest will be Ian Bly of Optimized Results. Ian will be speaking with us about communication excellence.
For text and transcripts of the show and other shows On the Personal Life Media Network, please visit our website at personallifemedia.com. Again, this is your host Jason McClain, your guide in the 21st-century marketplace
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